Foods of the World Forum Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > The Best Foods You Can Get - Your Own > Gardening
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Notes for gardening in north-central Montana
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

This site is completely supported by donations; there are no corporate sponsors. We would be honoured if you would consider a small donation, to be used exclusively for forum expenses.



Thank you, from the Foods of the World Forums!

Notes for gardening in north-central Montana

 Post Reply Post Reply
Author
Message
TasunkaWitko View Drop Down
Admin Group
Admin Group
Avatar

Joined: 25 January 2010
Location: Chinook, MT
Status: Offline
Points: 8670
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TasunkaWitko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Notes for gardening in north-central Montana
    Posted: 21 March 2015 at 08:59
In a hurry, will flesh this out:

A) Start tomatoes and peppers by March 10th for best results.
If you are a visitor and like what you see, please click here and join the discussions in our community!
Back to Top
drinks View Drop Down
Chef's Apprentice
Chef's Apprentice


Joined: 19 September 2014
Location: male
Status: Offline
Points: 373
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote drinks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 March 2015 at 11:44
I am sure you are growing them inside, both really need 120 days to make fruit, I am surprised you can make a crop where you live.
What is your frost free average time in a year?
Back to Top
drinks View Drop Down
Chef's Apprentice
Chef's Apprentice


Joined: 19 September 2014
Location: male
Status: Offline
Points: 373
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote drinks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 March 2015 at 11:55
I see you have 92 days average frost free, of course this does not give the degree days, so important in growing corn.
Where I live it is 247 days average and we have a lot of degree days.
Corn, peppers, squash and okra love it, tomatoes and some others are more delicate, I have to select very early tomatoes to be able to get any before it gets too hot for the blooms to set.
Back to Top
HistoricFoodie View Drop Down
Master Chef
Master Chef


Joined: 21 February 2012
Location: Kentucky
Status: Offline
Points: 4466
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HistoricFoodie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 March 2015 at 13:16
> both really need 120 days to make fruit,<

That's an awful rough generalization, Drinks. There are early varieties of both that mature in half that time, and everything in between. Most late season tomatoes run 85-90 days to maturity---which, I assume, is what you mean by "make fruit."

Even though both peppers and tomatoes are typically started indoors, days-to-maturity are counted from the time a seed or seedling is put in the ground.
But we hae meat and we can eat
And sae the Lord be thanket
Back to Top
drinks View Drop Down
Chef's Apprentice
Chef's Apprentice


Joined: 19 September 2014
Location: male
Status: Offline
Points: 373
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote drinks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 March 2015 at 14:11
Yep, from setting out the plants.
I really am not a fan of early tomatoes, most do not have the flavor of 80-90 day varieties.
There are some cherry and miniature plum varieties that do have some flavor, one I do like and that is a hot weather bearer is the Porter cherry.
Determinate varieties usually do not have the flavor of the indeterminate varieties, but here most will not make it through the 100-110 ' heat in the summer, the peppers love it if they get enough water, so most of what I grow is peppers.
I did grow a lot of okra, but the root nematodes moved in and put a stop to okra.
I do like fresh corn, but it takes quite a bit of room for it and I am getting lazy, actually, at 74 I am really running out of steam.
Back to Top
HistoricFoodie View Drop Down
Master Chef
Master Chef


Joined: 21 February 2012
Location: Kentucky
Status: Offline
Points: 4466
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HistoricFoodie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 March 2015 at 19:47
I agree with you about most early tomatoes being all but flavorless. But there are many mid-season types that are flavorsome. For my money, the best tasting are the late season pinks.

The thing about determinate types is 1. most gardeners haven't a clue what you're talking about, 2. there aren't a hell of a lot of them, and, 3. They're really designed for canning, cuz they all come in at once.

Thanks to piss-poor info from some of the big seed houses, many growers confuse dwarf with determinate. But they're two different things.

One that is full of flavor, if you can find seed for it, is Southern Nights, a black determinate from the Crimea.

I'm not a fan of most cherry tomatoes. If I want a candy bar I'll get me a snickers. But Friend Wife likes them, so we usually grow one or two plants. I do like the Riesentraube cherry, though, because it tastes like a tomato rather than s dessert.

Sorry to hear about your okra problem. Okra is one of my favorite things to grow and eat.

Although I've grown demonstration plots of heirloom corns---such as Virginia Gourdseed and Cherokee White---I really don't have enough room to grow it as a table crop.
But we hae meat and we can eat
And sae the Lord be thanket
Back to Top
TasunkaWitko View Drop Down
Admin Group
Admin Group
Avatar

Joined: 25 January 2010
Location: Chinook, MT
Status: Offline
Points: 8670
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TasunkaWitko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 March 2015 at 21:21
Originally posted by drinks drinks wrote:

I am sure you are growing them inside, both really need 120 days to make fruit, I am surprised you can make a crop where you live.

What is your frost free average time in a year?

Hi, Don - sorry for not getting back to you sooner. I'm really having trouble keeping up with life these days. The good news is, it's all good - just busy...lol

Yes, I do indeed mean to start them indoors, from seed. Unfortunately, I missed my chance, as the cats destroyed the ones my son started before they could even start.

Luckily, my dad started several varieties on March 10th, As usual, planted extra, and I was able to snag some good seedlings yesterday when he was thinning his down a bit. Thanks to his foresight, I have at least a dozen tomato plants, right on schedule according to the March 10th starting date. He tends to plant several varieties, so I got a decent mix: Early Girl, Gurney Girl, Rutgers, some kind of Beefsteak, Cherokee Purple, Cherry, Celebrity .... As I said, I got a dozen seedlings in all, doubled up on his favourites such as Gurney Girl and Celebrity. All are seeds that he's been saving over the years and which seem to produce pretty well. We'll see how it goes. He has a pretty well-defined transplanting method, so I think that they should all do well, but he held on to a few extra seedlings just in case any die over the next week or two. 

His peppers haven't come up yet, but they are just regular bell peppers and jalapenos, neither of which I have much use for. Last year, Wal-Mart or one of the local greenhouse nurseries had some Hungarian-type peppers, and If they have any more this year, I'll grab two or four of those. It's just the tomatoes and peppers that need to be started early. After that, it's pumpkins, watermelons, cantaloupe or honey-dew melons, cucumbers, potatoes, onions and then some root crops (probably radishes and carrots). These can all be started early. I think that's enough stuff to be reasonably manageable and keep me busy at the same time, but if something else interesting comes along that can fit in, I'll give it a go.

In general, we can count on 15 May to 15 September as far as frost-free days. This might start a few days earlier and will most certainly run a few days longer, but it is a good rule of thumb for this area.
If you are a visitor and like what you see, please click here and join the discussions in our community!
Back to Top
TasunkaWitko View Drop Down
Admin Group
Admin Group
Avatar

Joined: 25 January 2010
Location: Chinook, MT
Status: Offline
Points: 8670
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TasunkaWitko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 March 2015 at 21:25
Originally posted by Brook Brook wrote:

One that is full of flavor, if you can find seed for it, is Southern Nights, a black determinate from the Crimea.

Brook, you have my interest (you know why!) .... If you know where to get them, let me know! It may be too late to realistically start them, but I am willing to try! Thumbs Up
If you are a visitor and like what you see, please click here and join the discussions in our community!
Back to Top
HistoricFoodie View Drop Down
Master Chef
Master Chef


Joined: 21 February 2012
Location: Kentucky
Status: Offline
Points: 4466
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HistoricFoodie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 March 2015 at 05:13
Sorry, Ron. I've been searching for seed for a number of years with no luck.

Keep in mind, too, that there is widespread misuse of the term determinate. As a result, many gardeners believe it applies to dwarf and patio varieties, which is not the case. Determinate has a precise horticultural meaning. Part of it refers to the fact that the fruit all comes in at one time.

But we hae meat and we can eat
And sae the Lord be thanket
Back to Top
drinks View Drop Down
Chef's Apprentice
Chef's Apprentice


Joined: 19 September 2014
Location: male
Status: Offline
Points: 373
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote drinks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 March 2015 at 09:15
Southern night, black-purple tomato from Crimea, seeds are available from Tomatofest.com.
Happy munching.
They are a midseason indeterminate.
Back to Top
TasunkaWitko View Drop Down
Admin Group
Admin Group
Avatar

Joined: 25 January 2010
Location: Chinook, MT
Status: Offline
Points: 8670
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TasunkaWitko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 March 2015 at 17:22
Very cool, Don - thank you! Beer

Doing separate searches under "Crimea," Krim" and "black" at www.tomatofest.com, I was able to find a few that are purported to be similar - in addition to the "southern night." 
 
I know this is probably just wishful thinking, but do you guys see any way that any of these could be started at this late date? If there's a way, I might order some and perhaps move them indoors as autumn approaches.... just reading the descriptions of some make my mouth water....
 
I also noticed that they all bear a resemblance to the one that I've been calling "Cherokee Purple," making me wonder if that tomato is as "Cherokee" as the name implies, or if it is just a coincidence. I guess when you get down to it, since the tomato originated in the new world, the black sea/Crimea tomatoes might be the Johnny-come-latelies...
If you are a visitor and like what you see, please click here and join the discussions in our community!
Back to Top
drinks View Drop Down
Chef's Apprentice
Chef's Apprentice


Joined: 19 September 2014
Location: male
Status: Offline
Points: 373
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote drinks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 March 2015 at 20:10
Ron, all you can loose is a few seeds, go ahead and try to grow some.
If you can keep them in a warm window when it starts getting cold, they may last a while. if nothing else, pull the vines when the first frost is due and hang them inside until the green ones ripen.
If they are mature but still green , they will ripen, if they are not, make pickled green tomatoes with them.
That is a standard item in the catfish houses on the south.
If you are interested, there are plenty of recipes on line and I have my own, too, which I can post if you are interested.
Back to Top
drinks View Drop Down
Chef's Apprentice
Chef's Apprentice


Joined: 19 September 2014
Location: male
Status: Offline
Points: 373
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote drinks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 March 2015 at 20:20
Ron, to get the seeds to sprout as soon as possible, lightly sand them between fine sandpaper, soak overnight in buttermilk and put the peat pots on a heating pad in a clear plastic box until they sprout, I have sprouted tomato and pepper seeds in as little as 6 days doing it that way.
Started in the next few days, they SHOULD be bearing in July.
Back to Top
TasunkaWitko View Drop Down
Admin Group
Admin Group
Avatar

Joined: 25 January 2010
Location: Chinook, MT
Status: Offline
Points: 8670
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TasunkaWitko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 April 2015 at 21:56
I ordered 5 different "Russian Black" varieties, but they arrived far too late to plant. I gave my dad a few black cherry tomato seeds to try, and will plan better next year. Up here, March 10th is the critical date.
If you are a visitor and like what you see, please click here and join the discussions in our community!
Back to Top
drinks View Drop Down
Chef's Apprentice
Chef's Apprentice


Joined: 19 September 2014
Location: male
Status: Offline
Points: 373
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote drinks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2015 at 15:25
Bette luck next year!
Back to Top
drinks View Drop Down
Chef's Apprentice
Chef's Apprentice


Joined: 19 September 2014
Location: male
Status: Offline
Points: 373
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote drinks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2015 at 15:44
Ron, go to amazon.com, search for russian tomato plants, or black tomato plants, there are both determinate and indeterminate plants available. as low as $6, plus shipping for 4 plants, most cost less than $13, with shipping for 4 plants.
I would think you would have time for them, even at this date.
Back to Top
TasunkaWitko View Drop Down
Admin Group
Admin Group
Avatar

Joined: 25 January 2010
Location: Chinook, MT
Status: Offline
Points: 8670
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TasunkaWitko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 April 2015 at 21:45
That's a pretty dang good idea...I did a quick search and found some. 

I'll take a closer look on payday and talk to the Beautiful Mrs. Tas ... see what she wants to do!Thumbs Up
If you are a visitor and like what you see, please click here and join the discussions in our community!
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down



This page was generated in 0.094 seconds.